HXT 63-xx Upgrade thread

[pullin-gs]

Please, This is a a "how-to" thread, not a "why would you discussion" thread. I'll answer the "wye"(;)) right now: "because I want to!:D"
Here's the deal, I have a brand-new HXT 63-74 I'd like to improve.
This thread is open to on-topic ideas/solutions....post away!
Things that come to mind which I would like answers to:
1)Bearings: Where do I get them? Your Experience so far?
2)Magnets: How can I stablize them without the effort of removing them and regluing them? JB-weld between them?
3)QC of windings...does it make sense to secure the windings in place with some sort of heat-resistant glue?
4)Cooling....my requirement is not an e-flight application. I am leaning toward a simple pc-fan to handle this. Other/better options?
5)Rust on armature....not expecting water....but you never know.
Cheers!
Pullin'

[Ron van Sommeren]

1- bearings
www.bocabearings.com (http://www.bocabearings.com)
www.rc-bearings.com (http://www.rc-bearings.com)
www.vxb.com (http://www.vxb.com)

2- Magnet stabilizing
http://www.torcman.de/index_e.htm
-> downloads
-> Assembly Procedure TM280, 350, 430
-> chapter 3

3-

4- cooling
Built-in fan, modify/change backplate

5- Rust will not cause problems, and stator is insulated anyway, the green or blue stuff.



What is your application?

Vriendelijke groeten ;) Ron

[pullin-gs]

Thanks for the info...much appreciated.
E-Bike.
Have you ever played with the idea of dynamic re-configuration between WYE and DELTA setups (via MOSFETs) in a brushless? If I'm not mistaken, KV halves when the same windings are reconfigured from Delta to WYE?

The EV crowd spends much thought/effort finding fancy multi-ratio gearing for our toys....yet a simple electrical mod within the motor can achieve the same purpose. Hmmmm.....
Doh! Just hijacked my own thread!

Thanks again. I'll look into your info in more detail in the AM.

Cheers!

P

[Ron van Sommeren]

... If I'm not mistaken, KV halves when the same windings are reconfigured from Delta to WYE? ...Almost correct, you're only off by 10%. Not down by a factor two, but by a factor 1.7-1.8 (sqrt(3) if signals were sinusoidal instead of trapezoid) . Kt, Torque per Ampère, not torque by itself!, goes up by the same factor.

I take it you are on www.endless-sphere.com (http://www.endless-sphere.com) a.o.?

Vriendelijke groeten ;) Ron

[MilesH]

The EV crowd spends much thought/effort finding fancy multi-ratio gearing for our toys....yet a simple electrical mod within the motor can achieve the same purpose. Hmmmm.....

Not exactly... It depends what "purpose" you're referring to...

[carlsoti]

The EV crowd spends much thought/effort finding fancy multi-ratio gearing for our toys....yet a simple electrical mod within the motor can achieve the same purpose.

P
Electronic gearless "shifting"?!?! great idea!

[Ron van Sommeren]

Variable Kv motor
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=FR&hl=fr&v=6_41btVawMc

Vriendelijke groeten ;) Ron

[timocharis]

QC of windings...does it make sense to secure the windings in place with some sort of heat-resistant glue?No. The windings are not moving and there is no reason to expect them to shift. Any additional coating antagonizes cooling and is best avoided without a very good reason.
Have you ever played with the idea of dynamic re-configuration between WYE and DELTA setups (via MOSFETs) in a brushless?Yes and no. Not by using the mosfets, but just by switching. Ron has already pointed out the ^3 issue, but I can tell you it works just fine. In fact, you can get all manner of gearing ratios using parallel/wye/delta combinations -- enough to make a gearbox look silly.


Dave

[MilesH]

enough to make a gearbox look silly.

Not really......... :)

[timocharis]

Really! The most straightforward (assuming a 12-tooth stator and a single strand per tooth) gives you a ho-hum six speeds. But if you use two strands per tooth, you can manage 12.

It goes up from there (and is not at all impractical on larger motors). The ratios get pretty wild too. Of course, you can also add teeth to get a fairly fine "mesh."


Dave

[MilesH]

Hi Dave,

I wasn't questioning that you could get the "ratios". The somewhat limited advantage of electrical "gears" certainly doesn't make mechanical gears look silly, though :D

Miles

[pullin-gs]

My bad.....did'nt mean to go off topic with the wye/delta switchover talk....sounds like a really cool topic for a dedicated thread! :D
Especially in the EV forum.

Back on topic:
About the windings....it's not that they move, it's that they are sloppilly wound, with some wires actually air-gapping realitive to thier neighboring winds. Any type of gap invites possible motor failure it the stator (the spinning part???....cant lock down terminology on outrunners) comes in contact with a dangling wire.

Next question:
Super-cheap controllers with this motor.....any experience on how they behave (startup, etc) with a stock HXT motor? Say a 100amp sustained rated variety. I'm hoping 40-amps sustained will not release the magic smoke with an adaquately heat-sinked controller.

Cheers!

Pullin'

[Ron van Sommeren]

E-Bike Non-hub Motor Drives
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=28

Using RC motors on E-bikes
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=4625

Use extra caps!!! All ESC manufacturers say the same, long battery wires is not a good idea, will cost you your controller. Extend motor wires instead. Add extra ESC input capacitors if you must extend battery wires.
ESC manufacturer statements, workarounds, rules of thumb, manuals:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=952523&highlight=kill
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=7504


Vriendelijke groeten ;) Ron

[timocharis]

About the windings....it's not that they move, it's that they are sloppily wound, with some wires actually air-gapping... possible motor failure if ...the spinning part... comes in contact with a dangling wire.Hmm. You may have found a very good reason for some glue. Or, for that matter, rewinding (EEEK!)

But I'd first try just smooshing them into place and see if they're likely to stay. If not, urk slop goes the glue...


Dave

[Ron van Sommeren]

A dab of glue certainly won't hurt.

Immobilizing coils in an industrial motor, last picture:
www.eschmidt.onlineelektro.de/ ... /drehstrom (http://www.eschmidt.onlineelektro.de/scripts/show.aspx?content=/shop/home/leistung/motoren/drehstrom)

Video of (industrial) motorwindings moving and chafing during operation, shot with high speed camera
winding in slow motion (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPNU2vniUIc) (0 min 34 sec)

[Ron van Sommeren]

Upgrading an HXT-motor
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=10850